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    Seeking writers with positive stories, anecdotes, essays, announcements, posts and experiences involving the SBC. WHAT'S GOD UP TO IN YOUR CHURCH? YOUR SCHOOL? YOUR VOCATION? YOUR MISSION FIELD?

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April 23, 2012


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Hi Hariette. I think you have it backwards. I think the shorter fellow is the Calvinist in this cartoon. The one you call laid back is the Arminian. IMO he is turning the "predestination" thing back on his Calvinist friend. The Calvinist, the angry one, is throwing the "free will" thing back on his Arminian friend. At least that's what I see.

Drew Wales

I'm sorry if you feel this was a misrepresentation. There are a couple of things I'd like to address. I am the author of the article, and I really just did an image search on google never thinking for a second the image I chose would be the focal point of the article. It took me all of 20 seconds to find an image and put it in the post. There was no malice intended.

The point of the article is to draw attention to the debate as a whole, and point out that there should be no argument. Both sides are guilty of being less than helpful, myself included.

And for what its worth my take on the image is this: Anyone (hand in pocket or not) talking about decking someone in the face is hardly laid back as you claim.\

Secondly, I'm alarmed by your characterization of reformers. You quickly say that I'm misrepresenting your camp with my image selection, yet you claim:

"Yep...this is not a fair and balanced neutral representation at all. Most New Calvinism folk don't wear ties, or suits and they are young and restless and rapper-friendly looking."

Have you seen my picture? Have you seen Josh, my co-contributors profile? There is nothing "rapper-friendly looking" about us, whatever that means. Put me in a line up and 100 times out of 100 I would be accused of looking like an insurance salesman or a preacher, not a "rapper." For someone that drew offense so quickly at a "mischaracterization", you were quick to lob one right back in the other direction.

Again, I'm sorry if it was offensive, the point of the article was to show that there is common ground, we have coexisted, we can continue to do so, and that we are actually stronger together. I apologize that my message was cloaked in offensive misrepresentations, it was not my intent.


Hi there, Les! Welcome to my neck of the woods. ask me if I'm surprised I got it backwards? Of course I got it backwards, I always get it backwards. No matter what way I visualize or grasp a concept it is always backwards, ignorant, without merit or simply "passive aggressive". And if that doesn't work, I am a fundamental, legalistic, landmarkist. Been called about all of them. It's okay, though. I know my place. And it is right in the center of the two arguments. Neither-nor. :) Carry brother...selahV


Drew, nice to meet ya. Glad you stopped by to explain how wrong I am about what I see in a cartoon that meant nothing per se cause you just whipped it off the internet. I didn't really think it had a single thing to do with your post, I read over your post and found it rather interesting for folks who might find it interesting also. The cartoon was a by-product of my right-brain obsession for all things visual. Just thought I'd drop a little humor into the stream of mental-musing to see what might pop up. Obviously I was wrong. I know this because you and Les told me I am wrong.

As I told Les, it doesn't come as a surprise to me that I am wrong. Nothing I think I have understood from the camps of either side is right. So as far as being in one camp or the other, you have THAT wrong. okie dokie? I have friends in both camps...don't know how, but I do.

I hope you have a wonderful day and that my dumb little post doesn't upset ya'll too much. I know that it really upset a bunch of folks when Dr. Brad Whitt referred to wearing a suit in a post he wrote about being "irrelevant" a while back that it caused quite a ruckus among the YRR crowd. You'd have thought he told folks he was pro-nudist camps for crying out loud.

Pay me no mind, Drew. No one else does. I'm just a silly old lady in Oklahoma with nothing more to do than to sit around reading the arguments among you dudes on why this one or that one should have a seat at the table of Tables...--the stupidity of invitations, the idiocy of asking Jesus into our hearts, and how we have been doing church wrong for as long as I can remember and before, and how we are gonna get it right even if we have to take over each and every SBC church with Tom Ascol's DoG to do it.

It's no one is listening to me anyway. Pretend I am your crazy old aunt that you keep locked in the attic who escapes now and then and says silly things. You'll be happier that way. selahV



No need to heap scorn on yourself. I was wrong once. I got over it. :)

Totally just kidding.

No, on the cartoon, I was just expressing my opinion. You may have it right. That's just the way I saw it.

Put yer sackcloth and ashes away for the day.


Also, if things get going here and I don't show back up for a while, it's because I'm in Haiti. Heading there very early in the morning.

God bless.



Les, I look best in sack-cloth and ashes. The ashes blend well with my salt-and-pepper hair. :) Humor is a funny thing--to some folks, not so much to others.

Will be praying for your efforts in Haiti. May God's grace be upon you and your work be fruitful for His kingdom. selahV

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